descrimiMAMEtion...!

Discussion about MARP's regulation play

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kernzy
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descrimiMAMEtion...!

Post by kernzy »

HI!! :D
i thought i'd post my thoughts on some things.
this comes from one of my scores being demoted because of MARP rules. i only played cosmica1 once. i checked the scores, and it was the highest, so i entered it.
rules are rules. we must follow them, otherwise, chaos ensues. when i first started using MARP, it was total chaos. a hundred different mames are used here, everyone has their preferred mames. i know i do. some games don't even work on some mames, and some mames do not even support alot of roms available. coupled with the fact that only wolfmame is recognised for ALL number 1 records, why do we have the option of using every mame we can find to upload with? i mean, who in their right mind would actually use a non wolf mame to play a game to upload a score to only be in 2nd place or lower? i can't see the logic myself. coming from twin galaxies, i am talking about how they legitimise their scores. it works. MARP also do the same thing, but there are obviously alot more wolfmames to choose from. it gives great variety.
i was honest about my entry, i even stated it was not wolf in the details, knowing it would be rectified. the only other way it would have been noticed would have been by Brian, who obviously noticed it, and in a fit of jealousy, threw the rule book at me. (lol, only joking!! :D ) which brings me to my next point.
i have seen number 1 records on MARP that are like 10 YEARS OLD, and have not been verified, and scores that were entered today, top of the list right now is Brian himself, with "heavy unit", and it is verified. so what is the point of verifying anything, if even number 1 records are not? i'm sure that anyone who's score is beaten would check the inp for imperfections, like Brian did to mine. i looked at a few charts, and i see Brian also has a score that was entered using the wrong MAME, but the score still stands. :?: how comes the rules are not stuck to across the board? how comes number 1 records are not verified but the 2nd place and lower are? and if the top score is not verified, how do we actually know if it is actually a safe score, and not one big cheat? sounds very dodgy. if i had to call it, i would verify all number 1 entries first, as they are obviously more important than anything else.
as for using mame on the whole, i only use gui versions. so i am at a loss for not being able to play and enter scores for games i want to, and i cannot watch other peoples inp's to help me better myself either. if it wasn't for the gui mames, there would only be about 60 people on MARP, and the mame platform for twin galaxies would not exist.
taking this into consideration, how comes there has not been a wolfmame plus since 106? i see new mames every so often, and none are new gui versions. is somebody trying to squeeze out most mame users? it makes no sense at all.
how comes, when there are numerous front ends, does nobody release new mames with them included? how hard couild it be to include one? feels like it's turning into an elite club.
i am not moaning or complaining, just interested in how it all works.
cheers guys!!
all the best,
paul. :D
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Chad
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Re: descrimiMAMEtion...!

Post by Chad »

Presuming this rant is predicated that your recording was demote because of posted rules: Remember, your demoted 70k recording will always be stored even though it's ranked less than a 50k recording, people can still download it

http://replay.marpirc.net/r/cosmica1
http://replay.marpirc.net/inp/2/d/f/ppk ... win138.zip

and see that you got 70k, but it won't be makred on the leaderboard as 70k until it's a wolfmame recording. I'm not sure why you can't get wolfmame138 to run cosmica1

wolf138.exe cosmica1 works just fine here.
-skito
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kernzy
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Re: descrimiMAMEtion...!

Post by kernzy »

hi skito,
it's not ranting, really. i don't mind about the score, at all. it is meaningless to me, for real. i already got a 90,000 score earlier.
i just thought i'd share my thoughts that followed that event, hoping for some enlightenment.
i can play cosmica1, no problem. i just can't save the inp. i press "shift f12" to start and stop recording, but it goes into the snap folder, and is not submittable. pressing "r" did nothing.
i saw a renderer on there, don't know about that, though.
cheers, bud! :D
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Re: descrimiMAMEtion...!

Post by mahlemiut »

Shift F12 will toggle MNG recording (effectively creating an animated PNG).

For INP recording, use -record <filename> on the commandline

Or the easy way, use the included batch files - record <game shortname> <INP filename> [and optionally any further switches you may need]

QMC2 can also be used, for the commandline challenged/never-used-a-computer-older-than-1995/mac-user people out there :)
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Re: descrimiMAMEtion...!

Post by kernzy »

hi Barry,
you do remember who i am, don'tcha? this is paul "anti command line" kernzy. :lol:
i just had a flash back to a couple of months ago!!!
i was using wolf 141. it's command line based, but has a basic frontend also. i scanned the options to see what was what. never used commaaaaaaaaaaa***"bang"$*-^fizz****nd lines. just the gui. :D
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Re: descrimiMAMEtion...!

Post by mahlemiut »

Well, now that the MAME core does have a proper mouse pointer, whether or not some sort of built-in frontend could be done with MAME's UI functions... (obviously, something better than the basic "select a game" thing it has currently)
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Re: descrimiMAMEtion...!

Post by kernzy »

sorry Barry, you totally lost me!
#-o
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***PL***
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Re: descrimiMAMEtion...!

Post by ***PL*** »

MARP grandfathered 1st place recordings that did not use WOLF, but only if it was submitted prior to 3-3-03.

A score that is "confirmed" means that it was successfully played back to the "claimed" score. It can still be challenged on other grounds.


TG still uses MAME 0.106 as their official release for INP verifications because it was the last version with a built-in GUI. Now that's a problem!
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Re: descrimiMAMEtion...!

Post by kernzy »

INDEED!!!! [-o< [-o<
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Re: descrimiMAMEtion...!

Post by Barthax »

***PL*** wrote:TG still uses MAME 0.106 as their official release for INP verifications because it was the last version with a built-in GUI. Now that's a problem!
Hehe, that wasn't the reason. When 0.107 was released with the new rendering system it was decided to update TG's usage to the last "good release" and then wait for the new rendering to settle in before looking at updating it again. By the time anyone decided to look at the new releases again, I believe Barry was releasing source to Wolf patches due to MAME licencing requirements and some at TG put a block on upgrading until a "closed source" version of Wolf was released anew. I knew that wouldn't happen...
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Re: descrimiMAMEtion...!

Post by edusword »

I don't understand why there are a lot of rank #1 plays that are not validated, but other plays in lower positions (of other games) are inmediately validated. I think rank #1 plays should have preference. Sorry but it isn't fair...

Best regards!
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Re: descrimiMAMEtion...!

Post by Chad »

Are you talking TG or marp? Most Marp confirmation monitoring happens from brand new uploads. So sometimes #1's are forgotten to never be confirmed again unless someone uploads a non#1 to a unconfirmed #1 game, and then both are probably confirmed. But I can't find a non-archive*-ed recording that's unconfirmed and #1 at marp. Which game are you looking at?
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Re: descrimiMAMEtion...!

Post by edusword »

I'm talking about MARP, of course (TG doesn't mind)...

For example... some of my #1 unconfirmed recordings:
- Back Fire (Tecmo, bootleg) [backfirt] --> 7 recordings but only confirmed de last one.
- Ufo Robo Dangar (bootleg) [dangarb] --> 9 recordings (3 uncorfirmed, #1 included).
- Empire City: 1931 (US) [empcityu] --> 2 valid recordings only (but both unconfirmed).
- Koukuu Kihei Monogatari - The Legend of Air Cavalry (Japan) [legofair] --> 10 recordings (5 unconfirmed, #1 included) This game needs a MAME (current versions) default settings change, because they are different than the original arcade machine (the same case as the rest of the versions). Maybe MARP should make an special rule.
- Sauro (both versions) and Scorpion clones --> but these are very recent replays, so I think they are not the focus of this forum...

Some examples of other players #1 unconfirmed recordings:
- Final Star Force (US) [fstarfrc]
- US AAF Mustang (25th May. 1990) [mustang]
- Baryon - Future Assault [baryon]
- Air Attack (set 1) [airattck]
- Nastar Warrior (US) [nastarw]
- R-Type (Japan prototype) [rtypejp]
- Sunset Riders (2 Players ver JBD) [ssridersjbd]
- Grand Striker (Americas) [gstrikera]

I know that confirm the recordings requires a lot of time, so I understand that there are much #1 unconfirmed recordings, but I don't understand that the confirmation of a lot of non-#1 recordings have preference. clicking on the link "Up load" of the main page anyone can see this easily ;)

Best regards!
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Re: descrimiMAMEtion...!

Post by mahlemiut »

For me, it all depends on a combination of how interesting the game is, the possible quality of the score, and (lack of) leeching.
Leeching is a big turn off for me, it makes me fall asleep.
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Re: descrimiMAMEtion...!

Post by kernzy »

LOL!!
i have to speak!!!
Barry, check my bombjack number 1's. i assure you, if you ever liked this game, you will be happy to watch them!! very nice to watch. to say this game is not interesting is to say that donkey kong is. believe me, it isn't. (kong, not bomb jack!!) and also, lord gaz's ex record. nearly 10 years old now.
i obviously don't need my scores verifying, as they are legitimate, just trying to give you a decent evenings viewing for a change!! :lol: :lol: :lol:
and i agree, number 1's should be given preference to all other placings, otherwise, there is no point to verifying anything...
all the best,
paul. :D
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