What are the community's feelings about the -fast splits for various Pac-Man games? The more I think about these, the more it seems to me that this is really a potential setting/dip switch change and not really an entirely different game. I raised the question last week about splitting on a few games in particular. It seems to me that, in all fairness, these splits should probably be removed as well.
<p>
Feedback?
Q.T.Quazar
--
qan@home.com
The Speed-Up Cheats
Moderator: Chad
-
JoustGod
Well, they were split in the first place because it was determined
that indeed these were legitimate, stand-alone versions of the
originals. You look at it as a mere dip switch/setting issue.
However, the arcade operators of the day when these fast Pac-Man
viewed the new versions as a completely new ball game for them. Yes,
basically the same game, but it was presented as a "new" version and
the speed-up Pac games then proliferated across the country. I know
this as I was both a travelling musician and arcade rat in the early
80s, thus I have personally witnessed the phenomenon of the "new"
onslaught of Pac-Games as they were given a second life. Once the
speed-up versions hit the streets, it was nearly impossible to find a
regular speed Pac game. Do I have motivation for making a case for
keeping the speed ups? Yes. I put in the time towards these games
under the assumption that we had settled this issue and would hate to
see it go by the wayside because of this point of view you bring up.
In actuality, the speed up games present a whole different version of
the Pac games genre as old patterns simply don't work, as well as
many other more subtle differences. If the games are that much easier
to play, as some might think, then why hasn't there been a mass
of "kill screen" games? Partly, it is due to the "purists" who have
perfected the skills needed to play a 3+ hour session to achieve
their magnificent scores. They tend not to bother with the speed up
versions and will actually look down upon those who pursue them. A
shame to be sure.
<p>
If the issue becomes the mere fact that these games
are "modifications", then we have opened up a can of worms (creating
quite a mess, for those who don't understand "can of worms")
concerning a whole array of other games that, with a certain point of
view, could be construed as "modifications" also. The many versions
of Mahjong, for instance (for which there are at least 86 variations
on the same theme). Or perhaps, the many revisions of Mortal Kombat
or Street Fighter games or any game that has seperate entries for
small, inconsequential modifications. At least with the Pac game
modification, it DID present a much different version and set of
strategies. Easier strategies? I seem to remember one of the hallowed
Pac players from Canada stating that playing these speed ups was
like "shooting fish in a barrel" (thus inspiring my commentary at the
time when I submitted my Jr. Pac Man score). Once again, I ask you
where are all the "kill screen" games if it was that much easier?
Especially with Ms. PacMan in which the "kill screen" comes around in
about half the time of PacMan. Curious indeed...
<p>
Thanks for listening as I hope this presents a valid view for you to
consider.
<p>
JoustGod
--
pinballwiz1@lvcm.com
that indeed these were legitimate, stand-alone versions of the
originals. You look at it as a mere dip switch/setting issue.
However, the arcade operators of the day when these fast Pac-Man
viewed the new versions as a completely new ball game for them. Yes,
basically the same game, but it was presented as a "new" version and
the speed-up Pac games then proliferated across the country. I know
this as I was both a travelling musician and arcade rat in the early
80s, thus I have personally witnessed the phenomenon of the "new"
onslaught of Pac-Games as they were given a second life. Once the
speed-up versions hit the streets, it was nearly impossible to find a
regular speed Pac game. Do I have motivation for making a case for
keeping the speed ups? Yes. I put in the time towards these games
under the assumption that we had settled this issue and would hate to
see it go by the wayside because of this point of view you bring up.
In actuality, the speed up games present a whole different version of
the Pac games genre as old patterns simply don't work, as well as
many other more subtle differences. If the games are that much easier
to play, as some might think, then why hasn't there been a mass
of "kill screen" games? Partly, it is due to the "purists" who have
perfected the skills needed to play a 3+ hour session to achieve
their magnificent scores. They tend not to bother with the speed up
versions and will actually look down upon those who pursue them. A
shame to be sure.
<p>
If the issue becomes the mere fact that these games
are "modifications", then we have opened up a can of worms (creating
quite a mess, for those who don't understand "can of worms")
concerning a whole array of other games that, with a certain point of
view, could be construed as "modifications" also. The many versions
of Mahjong, for instance (for which there are at least 86 variations
on the same theme). Or perhaps, the many revisions of Mortal Kombat
or Street Fighter games or any game that has seperate entries for
small, inconsequential modifications. At least with the Pac game
modification, it DID present a much different version and set of
strategies. Easier strategies? I seem to remember one of the hallowed
Pac players from Canada stating that playing these speed ups was
like "shooting fish in a barrel" (thus inspiring my commentary at the
time when I submitted my Jr. Pac Man score). Once again, I ask you
where are all the "kill screen" games if it was that much easier?
Especially with Ms. PacMan in which the "kill screen" comes around in
about half the time of PacMan. Curious indeed...
<p>
Thanks for listening as I hope this presents a valid view for you to
consider.
<p>
JoustGod
--
pinballwiz1@lvcm.com
-
Q.T.Quazar
Not sure if I agree with your last comments, but certainly the first
ones make sense.
<p>
My main concern with these is where to draw the line--how many of
these machines were sped-up? There's currently 12 Pac-Man romsets
alone, and that probably doesn't account for all of them. Should they
all be split, or should one or two be chosen?
--
qan@home.com
ones make sense.
<p>
My main concern with these is where to draw the line--how many of
these machines were sped-up? There's currently 12 Pac-Man romsets
alone, and that probably doesn't account for all of them. Should they
all be split, or should one or two be chosen?
--
qan@home.com
-
JoustGod
All of them. In my experience, I have seen all (well, not MsPacAttack
although I suspect it could have fallen under the speed-up frenzy of
the day) of the Pac games presented in speed-up form. Yes, even Jr.
Pacman...rare, but still saw it on two occasions. While Ms. Pacman
was certainly the most prevalent of the speed-ups, they were all
changed over at one point or another with very few example of
the "original" machines existing afterwards. I can't make a case for
the hacks such as Piranha, but I can make a case for the mainstream
Pac games. For the reasons I have stated, this presents the argument
that the speed-ups were seperate entities from their original
counterparts.
<p>
JoustGod
--
pinballwiz1@lvcm.com
although I suspect it could have fallen under the speed-up frenzy of
the day) of the Pac games presented in speed-up form. Yes, even Jr.
Pacman...rare, but still saw it on two occasions. While Ms. Pacman
was certainly the most prevalent of the speed-ups, they were all
changed over at one point or another with very few example of
the "original" machines existing afterwards. I can't make a case for
the hacks such as Piranha, but I can make a case for the mainstream
Pac games. For the reasons I have stated, this presents the argument
that the speed-ups were seperate entities from their original
counterparts.
<p>
JoustGod
--
pinballwiz1@lvcm.com
-
Tommi
It seems that nowadays most of the Ms pac games in USA are sped up.
It really doesn't matter to player if it's done using dips or if it's
a whole different rom/game, gameplay is different anyway. I
personally find fast versions a LOT more fun, original seems just
damn too slow for my taste. QT, you are once again looking too
strictly "rules" of marp, not seeing the purpose behind them. Why
make a fuss of something that's already been decided here before
anyway.
Yes, propably they all should be split to normal and fast, but are
they not already?
<p>
I recently had a vacation in California and Las Vegas!(Joustgod where
were you?), and stumbled into many pac-games during my trip. I
noticed that even two fast Ms Pac games can have somewhat different
gameplay, then again that might be the case of difficulty settings.
At Santa Monica pier was an interesting machine, that had eight!!!
Pac games, and all had normal and fast mode-selectable after
inserting coin. One of them was Ultra Pac-Man, which is not mamed
yet, also splitted to fast+ normal. I played one game of it, and got
a free game when eating a fruit
Had to play another then...
Gameworks Ms-Pac was harder version, I think.
--
tiihoto@hotmail.com
It really doesn't matter to player if it's done using dips or if it's
a whole different rom/game, gameplay is different anyway. I
personally find fast versions a LOT more fun, original seems just
damn too slow for my taste. QT, you are once again looking too
strictly "rules" of marp, not seeing the purpose behind them. Why
make a fuss of something that's already been decided here before
anyway.
Yes, propably they all should be split to normal and fast, but are
they not already?
<p>
I recently had a vacation in California and Las Vegas!(Joustgod where
were you?), and stumbled into many pac-games during my trip. I
noticed that even two fast Ms Pac games can have somewhat different
gameplay, then again that might be the case of difficulty settings.
At Santa Monica pier was an interesting machine, that had eight!!!
Pac games, and all had normal and fast mode-selectable after
inserting coin. One of them was Ultra Pac-Man, which is not mamed
yet, also splitted to fast+ normal. I played one game of it, and got
a free game when eating a fruit
Had to play another then...Gameworks Ms-Pac was harder version, I think.
--
tiihoto@hotmail.com