T14 - PAC has been disqualified

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Re: T14 - PAC has been disqualified

Postby mahlemiut » Mon Nov 30, 2015 8:36 pm

GJTMarper wrote:Hang on now, let's not throw the baby out with the bathwater here - not all of PAC's scores have been found to be illegit as of right now. Besides, Innuendo has something to gain by that particular score being disqualified:
slyspy Leaderboard:
1st - PAC with 1,140,000 points
2nd - Innuendo with 1,098,400 points


There's also this from the 2012 score confirmation log (bolded for emphasis):
Wed Aug 1 10:08:50 2012 : INNUENDO (rsm) confirmed the slyspy score of 1140000 by PAC (pacman)
Wed Aug 1 10:51:00 2012 : mahlemiut (br) confirmed the slyspy score of 1140000 by PAC (pacman)


I await Innuendo's and/or mahlemiut's comments on this.

Confirmation only ever means that it plays back. It's easy to miss things like this when only done for about 5 seconds at a few select points. Especially when you're trying to watch gameplay.
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Re: T14 - PAC has been disqualified

Postby GHEMANT » Tue Dec 01, 2015 3:42 am

For spanish community:

Pac = MEJOR JUGADOR ARCADE DEL MUNDO

For all the rest the world:

Pac = MEJOR CHEATER ARCADE DEL MUNDO.

LOL.

Now is the turn of P. Valmir. His Golden Axe WR fake is confirmed but... it's time to delete.
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Re: T14 - PAC has been disqualified

Postby GHEMANT » Tue Dec 01, 2015 3:44 am

BBH wrote:I realize of course that there are still members in the Spanish MAME community that don't want to believe PAC cheated, that think our findings on his recent recordings are bogus because we haven't released the full details (which we haven't done because we believe it to be very dangerous knowledge if it was to become widespread at this time). But when you consider this history of trying to sneak recordings by with autofire... is it really so much of a stretch to believe he would try to get away with breaking the rules in other ways too? He's not the clean, honest player that he may seem to some of you. Yes, he does have legitimate skills but his desire to be #1 on certain games led to him playing in illegitimate ways. If he's really innocent of these wrongdoings, why has he not responded in any way to these accusations? He's gone silent on this thread, and the thread on TG in which he accused us of being liars. Sometimes silence speaks volumes.


No words... 8O :?
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Re: T14 - PAC has been disqualified

Postby edusword » Tue Dec 01, 2015 9:22 am

GHEMANT wrote:For spanish community:

Pac = MEJOR JUGADOR ARCADE DEL MUNDO

For all the rest the world:

Pac = MEJOR CHEATER ARCADE DEL MUNDO.

LOL.


Please, do not assume that sentence as proclaimed by all the spanish arcade community. There are a lot of important spanish arcade players that believe in MARP accusations. And in a few days this number of players will probably be much greater.

I think it's time to get over your obvious spanish players trauma.
Regards!
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Re: T14 - PAC has been disqualified

Postby colman paolo » Tue Dec 01, 2015 4:09 pm

BBH wrote:You don't even need any external tools to see his autofire use in that Sly Spy recording. Just play the recording back with "-iv 1" to see his inputs. His button press rate varies throughout the beginning of the recording, as well it should and all seems normal there. But when he reaches the boss shark at ~31000 frames, his firing rate completely changes and becomes too consistent. It becomes a consistent 3 frames on, 3 frames off. Obviously this is the most important part for score because every hit registered on the shark is a bonus 10000 so obviously it would make sense to use autofire here. He does it again when he assembles the golden gun at ~49100 frames in, and once more at ~71700 frames in when he has to destroy the final force field. Yes, INNUENDO confirmed this score but I don't fault him for not catching it - confirmers are only confirming that the score plays back to the advertised score.

At least PAC wasn't dumb enough to use autofire in his entire recording, like saulonpb has kept doing in his 1943 recordings and elsewhere. PAC was smart enough not to keep it on the entire time, so as to make it more difficult to notice. And hey, it went under the radar for several years, so he'd gotten away with it for a while.

....on the other hand, back in 2010 it looks like he kept autofire on the entire time for his Chiki Chiki Boys replay during K8 (yes, during a tournament no less).
http://replay.marpirc.net/inp/9/d/5/pac ... olf106.zip

Constant 3 frame inputs on button 1 the entire time. It's actually pretty embarassing that this wasn't caught for so long. Just look at the consistency of those inputs with -iv 1 and tell me he's not using autofire.

I realize of course that there are still members in the Spanish MAME community that don't want to believe PAC cheated, that think our findings on his recent recordings are bogus because we haven't released the full details (which we haven't done because we believe it to be very dangerous knowledge if it was to become widespread at this time). But when you consider this history of trying to sneak recordings by with autofire... is it really so much of a stretch to believe he would try to get away with breaking the rules in other ways too? He's not the clean, honest player that he may seem to some of you. Yes, he does have legitimate skills but his desire to be #1 on certain games led to him playing in illegitimate ways. If he's really innocent of these wrongdoings, why has he not responded in any way to these accusations? He's gone silent on this thread, and the thread on TG in which he accused us of being liars. Sometimes silence speaks volumes.



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Re: T14 - PAC has been disqualified

Postby Zhorik » Tue Dec 01, 2015 6:19 pm

GHEMANT wrote:For spanish community:

Pac = MEJOR JUGADOR ARCADE DEL MUNDO

For all the rest the world:

Pac = MEJOR CHEATER ARCADE DEL MUNDO.

LOL.

GHEMANT, please don't insult the entire Spanish community just because some members of that community are hesitant to accept MARP's conclusions. That's unfair, and if anything I think we should be reaching out to the Spanish MAME community, trying to assure them we still value and appreciate their participation, and help them understand MARP's actions in this case. You're certainly free to express your opinion here, but let's keep things reasonably civil if possible.

I know you have additional concerns about the Golden Axe replay of P. Valmir, but if you'd like to discuss concerns about that replay can you please start a new thread on the Regulation Play forum about the replay and we can talk about it there.

Thanks,
George
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Re: T14 - PAC has been disqualified

Postby MJS » Tue Dec 22, 2015 8:05 pm

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Re: T14 - PAC has been disqualified

Postby Marco Marocco » Sun Dec 27, 2015 6:10 am

I think Pac must be banned from Marp: now he's uploading new scores like notingh was happened.
I hope in a strong decision by our Editors !
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Re: T14 - PAC has been disqualified

Postby franco.benedetti » Sun Dec 27, 2015 6:57 am

Marco Marocco wrote:I think Pac must be banned from Marp: now he's uploading new scores like notingh was happened.
I hope in a strong decision by our Editors !


thought he would be smart enough not to send any other score, instead he did #-o

are we sure he is not testing some new cheating ways? and even if he is not, who would waste time trying to find it out? I wouldn't

permaban pls
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Re: T14 - PAC has been disqualified

Postby mahlemiut » Sun Dec 27, 2015 7:28 am

He appears to be uploading old INPs. Some, at least, seem to push leeching to the limit. Why they weren't uploaded before is a mystery...
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Re: T14 - PAC has been disqualified

Postby GJTMarper » Sun Dec 27, 2015 2:37 pm

mahlemiut wrote:He appears to be uploading old INPs. Some, at least, seem to push leeching to the limit. Why they weren't uploaded before is a mystery...


Because most of them would be first placers on the leaderboard?

In any case, dumping a ridiculous amount of high-ranking and probably old INPs on the staff at once = not cool = suspicious. (Yes, I know TK2012 does bunches of submissions at once, but those are from slot machines where it would be easy to record and submit a bunch at once in one day in free time - PAC has either been keeping these to himself for a long time or had "help" making them.)
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Re: T14 - PAC has been disqualified

Postby colman paolo » Mon Dec 28, 2015 3:33 pm

PAC go home
Golden era rules!
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Re: T14 - PAC has been disqualified

Postby PAC-MAN » Wed Dec 30, 2015 5:26 pm

GHEMANT wrote:For spanish community:

Pac = MEJOR JUGADOR ARCADE DEL MUNDO

For all the rest the world:

Pac = MEJOR CHEATER ARCADE DEL MUNDO.

LOL.

Now is the turn of P. Valmir. His Golden Axe WR fake is confirmed but... it's time to delete.



Ghemant Im a great player. If I made a cheat with any INP just invalidate it.
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Re: T14 - PAC has been disqualified

Postby PAC-MAN » Wed Dec 30, 2015 5:29 pm

GJTMarper wrote:
mahlemiut wrote:He appears to be uploading old INPs. Some, at least, seem to push leeching to the limit. Why they weren't uploaded before is a mystery...


Because most of them would be first placers on the leaderboard?

In any case, dumping a ridiculous amount of high-ranking and probably old INPs on the staff at once = not cool = suspicious. (Yes, I know TK2012 does bunches of submissions at once, but those are from slot machines where it would be easy to record and submit a bunch at once in one day in free time - PAC has either been keeping these to himself for a long time or had "help" making them.)


I have a lot INP than I not submited beacuse they were not significant. But there are not cheat in it . You can check the INP
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Re: T14 - PAC has been disqualified

Postby PAC-MAN » Wed Dec 30, 2015 5:31 pm

Marco Marocco wrote:I think Pac must be banned from Marp: now he's uploading new scores like notingh was happened.
I hope in a strong decision by our Editors !


When a INP is cheated just invalidate it , but you cant invalidate the right ones
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